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» Biblical Studies Carnival 18 over atDeinde from Ketuvim: the Writings of James R. Getz Jr.
I havent had time to post this past week, but I figured I should at least note that the Biblical Studies Carnival is up at Deinde. Theres a lot of good insights this month, including quite a bit on canon a subject near and dear to... [Read More]

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Doug Chaplin

I might get round to a longer comment on my blog. Thanks for taking the time to interact with me. I fully agree with what you say about the diversity of text-forms and varieties of texts read over the first several centuries of emerging Christianity and (Rabbinic) Judaism. It does seem to me, however, that the general Christian adoption of e.g. Sirach may have played a part in its rejection by the rabbis, and that it is not just later Christian supersessionism to blame for ignoring the Hebrew text.
On a different point - I would be glad if the NIV provided any text of Sirach before people start asking for two!

Peter Kirk

unattributed quotes of Greek Ben Sira are found in the New Testament

Where? Nestle-Aland 27th edition lists two such quotations in their "Loci Citati vel Allegati", at Mark 10:19 and 2 Timothy 2:19. The former consists of two words "do not defraud" which are textually dubious, and the latter consists of two and a half words "depart from iniquity". In both cases the context is quite different from that in Ben Sira 4:1 and 17:26, and the similar wording could be entirely accidental. It certainly cannot be claimed on this basis that Ben Sira is being taken as an authoritative source of teaching.

JohnFH

Doug and Peter,

your comments encourage me to think further about these matters. Having looked into the question for myself, I concur with Peter that the quotations from Greek Ben Sira in Nestle-Aland's list are not quotations at all. I plan to revise the post soon to reflect this and some other matters.

Kevin P. Edgecomb

John and all, you might find this page handy, also. It's the text of all the allusions from the apocrypha and pseudepigrapha (from NRSV or Charlesworth's OTP) listed in UBS4 and NA27 along with the NRSV text. Some of them are very possible, some are not similar at all, even in Greek (etc), (in which case I suspect that the person who originally submitted the citation was utilizing an edition with differing versification than that found in Charlesworth). Many are simply the use of a word in common between the two or general imagery. I've sat down to categorize the allusions before, but have yet to complete the project. Anyhow, it's nice to have them all in one place in order to read them.

Philip Sumpter

There is an interesting project at the École Biblique called "The Bible and its Traditions": a new Jerusalem Study Bible which especially emphasises such textual diverstiy, as well as the history of interpretation etc. You can read about it on their website here: www.ebaf.edu

JohnFH

Philip, the École Biblique project is very interesting. I mention it in "Thinking about Canon (Final Update)," and you'll note that commenters there wonder what the final result will be. We'll have a better idea when a first fascicle appears.

Philip Sumpter

One question that I have about the project is, when the commentator gets to the "constructive theological" bit, i.e. what he/she thinks the text is saying, what text does he choose? The commentary will emphasise textual diversity, but when it comes to making a constructive statement surely you have to decide, for example, on whether to take the MT or LXX rendering.

Philip Sumpter

The committee hasn't yet designated one text form as authoritative for the comment section (and being Catholic they aren't in a rush to argue for the exclusivity of the MT).

JohnFH

I suspect that they will follow the excellent lead of Adrian Schenker (see his Das Neue am Neuen Bund und das Alte am Alten : Jer 31 in der Hebraischen und Griechischen Bibel, Von der Textgeschichte zu Theologie, Synagoge und Kirche, 2006), who attempts to tease out the broader implications of significant textual differences, and describe the impact of said differences on the history of interpretation.

Philip Sumpter

Wow, I'll have to get my hands on that. Nevertheless, it still sounds like a descriptive work, i.e. describing how the various texts have been received by various communities and the impact the texts have had. I met Justin recently and he told me that there would also be a "constructive" part (called 'Propositions de lecture' in the French version, I think). As some point the commentator has got to make a stand and say, "The theological implications of this text are ... based on ...". That would mean making a theological decision concerning the relationship between text and theology, which would have to be clarified and also possibly agreed upon amongst the various commentators responsible for this section, n'est pas? That could, perhaps, be the place where the specifically Catholic nature of the commentary would come to the fore.

Philip Sumpter

I've just found out that the conclusions of the Council of Trent will be decisive for the Study Bible. That goes some way to answering my question above, though they will have to engage in theological work explaining how the Septuagint will function authorititively in relation to the other witnesses (a problem going back to the early church).

amina

Greetings,
I'm seeking the Ethiopian Orthodox canon bible in English and Amharic, do you know where I can purchase? or is there something that comes close to it this book contains 81 books, Thank you

JohnFH

Dear Anima,

I can't help you there. It is my understanding that some of the books in question, in the text-form(s) preserved within Ethiopian Orthodox tradition, have yet to be translated into English.

Goldie Edwards

I'm not really so religious, but I've grown up in a very religious family. My father is very active in our church and he always encourage me to follow his steps in terms of serving our church, I'm not against with what my father wants me to do but sometimes I feel confuse with our church teachings. And I have a lot of confusion about the different teaching of different churches. Why is it churches can't be united with just one canon if all of them is saying that they are just preaching the word of God.

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